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 4-8 vs 2-10 
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Junior Bobcat

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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
x wrote:
I think the majority that disagree with you disagree because they expect more than 4 wins.

My expectation is 3-5 wins based on what I've seen the last couple of seasons, what I know we have returning, and what I know of the incoming players. We have to beat TSU, we have to win a minimum of 1-2 conference games, and we need to win a minimum of 3-4 games overall for the season to not be a complete failure. Another 2-10 season isn't ok in year 3 and I doubt you'll find anyone on this forum that would say it is. Very few will probably tell you 3-9 is ok either.

Agree with BG that how we look in losses is important too. The one thing that kept me ok with last year was it was pretty apparent 2017 TXST was superior to 2016 TXST even if they both went 2-10.

TheRevSWT wrote:
I get that we're either starting a true frosh or red shirt frosh QB


The frontrunner to win the QB job as of now is a sophomore.


I’m with this. Hoping/expecting 4-8. I can probably handle 3-9 if a vast majority of the losses are competitive. 2-10 is pretty unacceptable in year three and I’ve been pro Withers and giving him time. No doubt last year’s team was better than ‘16. This year needs to be better with a couple more wins to show for it.


Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:57 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
TheRevSWT wrote:

Fran also wasn't run out of town, he retired. Teis didn't want him to leave, and even gave him a week or two (memory is fading) to really make sure he wanted to retire. The fans (and players if rumors are to be believed) wanted Fran gone, not Teis.





I think with all the crap he was receiving from the fan base (yourself included) and the donors, he decided it was time to leave. He was definitely run out of town in that sense.

Your lack of good insight and blind hate for any conversations, no matter how well founded it is, started by me shows more than any non-existent "hate" I "have" for Withers.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:02 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
x wrote:
I think the majority that disagree with you disagree because they expect more than 4 wins.

My expectation is 3-5 wins based on what I've seen the last couple of seasons, what I know we have returning, and what I know of the incoming players. We have to beat TSU, we have to win a minimum of 1-2 conference games, and we need to win a minimum of 3-4 games overall for the season to not be a complete failure. Another 2-10 season isn't ok in year 3 and I doubt you'll find anyone on this forum that would say it is. Very few will probably tell you 3-9 is ok either.

Agree with BG that how we look in losses is important too. The one thing that kept me ok with last year was it was pretty apparent 2017 TXST was superior to 2016 TXST even if they both went 2-10.

TheRevSWT wrote:
I get that we're either starting a true frosh or red shirt frosh QB


The frontrunner to win the QB job as of now is a sophomore.



Guarantee you both Rev and Saul will try and paint a 2-10 or 3-9 season as a resounding success with vast improvement, they are both homers for Withers (Saul gets spoonfed info to put on this board by him and his staff). Look at Rev's signature pic of Withers on a throne for crying out loud.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:08 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
TheRevSWT wrote:
Now this one might be incorrect (memory is the second thing to go they say), but wasn't Wright in the last year of his contract? Or did he have 2 years left after the extension?




Goes to show how much you know, we bought him out because he had signed an extension after winning the first conference championship. It was three years of $180K left on his contract. The quotes from Teis also don't indicate some phantom friction between the two.

https://www.statesman.com/sports/colleg ... gZH4yAkPI/


Last edited by Bobcat.taxman on Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:10 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
stlwildcats wrote:
x wrote:

I’m with this. Hoping/expecting 4-8. I can probably handle 3-9 if a vast majority of the losses are competitive. 2-10 is pretty unacceptable in year three and I’ve been pro Withers and giving him time. No doubt last year’s team was better than ‘16. This year needs to be better with a couple more wins to show for it.




That's pretty much where I'm at also, but I don't think the coaching staff is making the right decisions to get us there. Which is why I'm wondering why we have such a long leash in comparison to both previous coaches I mentioned.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:12 pm
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True Bobcat Fan

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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
A. You're contributing a quote to me above that wasn't me.

B. Withers has completed two seasons at TXST. Wright was let go after 4. Fran left on his own accord after 5 while Teis publicly said he was hoping Fran would return for his 6th season. If Withers is still here after 4 seasons without improving the program beyond where it's at now you may have a point, but it's only been 2 seasons man.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:17 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
x wrote:
A. You're contributing a quote to me above that wasn't me.

B. Withers has completed two seasons at TXST. Wright was let go after 4. Fran left on his own accord after 5 while Teis publicly said he was hoping Fran would return for his 6th season. If Withers is still here after 4 seasons without improving the program beyond where it's at now you may have a point, but it's only been 2 seasons man.



True, but Wright was 7-5 his second year and 8-5 his third. Fran was 6-6 his third year and 7-5 his fourth. To recap:

Wright:
Year one: 4-8
Year two: 7-5
Year Three: 8-5

Fran:
Year one: 6-6
Year Two: 4-8
Year Three: 6-6
Year Four: 7-5

Withers:
Year one: 2-10
Year Two: 2-10
Year Three: ????

Both showed improvement early in their tenures, while we currently say "Well, 2017 was better than 2016".....which doesn't show either on the W/L column or most offensive and defensive statistics. For the amount of money he is receiving, Withers hasn't really shown anything indicating he will be the long term answer to turn us around. I think Mr. Fields was right from day one.


Sorry about the misquote, I think most people will see what I was quoting though, not necessarily who posted it.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:33 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
Don't forget Fran's 5th year: 3-9. With a pretty senior heavy team led by a 4-year starter at QB. 2015 was the year this program turned into the shit show we've now seen for the last 3 years. I don't know if Withers can correct it, but things went terribly wrong in 2015 under Fran and we're still trying to climb out of the hole created that season.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:49 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
Bobcat.taxman wrote:
I think with all the crap he was receiving from the fan base (yourself included) and the donors, he decided it was time to leave. He was definitely run out of town in that sense.


The first two words of your sentence shows exactly the problem with your argument.

Bobcat.taxman wrote:
Your lack of good insight and blind hate for any conversations, no matter how well founded it is, started by me shows more than any non-existent "hate" I "have" for Withers.


It's painfully obvious to anyone who reads what you post that you have a hate hard on for Withers. That, and... well, you're extremely simple.

But you did make a funny when you tried to say that your argument was "well founded". Genuinely funny from you, which is sadly common given your history.

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Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:57 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
I think everyone but phratty would agree with you Rev


Sat Jul 21, 2018 7:33 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
I have said from the beginning of the burn it down approach that all evaluation of withers should be put aside until year 3. It’s simply impossible to evaluate a coach based on the circumstances of his first two seasons. Year 3 is upon us and I think it’s fair to start with some reasonable expectations for improvement that actually include the win column. I am setting the bar at 4 and would consider anything more a very successful season for the given circumstances. I won’t necessarily give up on withers if it’s 3 wins, but we would have to be very competitive in almost every game. If it’s 2 again, it will be hard for me to publicly defend withers as I have in the past.


Sat Jul 21, 2018 10:30 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
Bobcat.taxman wrote:
TheRevSWT wrote:
Now this one might be incorrect (memory is the second thing to go they say), but wasn't Wright in the last year of his contract? Or did he have 2 years left after the extension?




Goes to show how much you know, we bought him out because he had signed an extension after winning the first conference championship. It was three years of $180K left on his contract. The quotes from Teis also don't indicate some phantom friction between the two.

https://www.statesman.com/sports/colleg ... gZH4yAkPI/


Way to... bust me on EXACTLY what I said? I mean, you are really reaching when the quote of me you are using actually says "now this one might be incorrect because my memory is not what it used to be" (paraphrasing).

Jesus man, you are a sad sack.

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Sat Jul 21, 2018 11:38 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
LT Spider wrote:
I have said from the beginning of the burn it down approach that all evaluation of withers should be put aside until year 3. It’s simply impossible to evaluate a coach based on the circumstances of his first two seasons. Year 3 is upon us and I think it’s fair to start with some reasonable expectations for improvement that actually include the win column. I am setting the bar at 4 and would consider anything more a very successful season for the given circumstances. I won’t necessarily give up on withers if it’s 3 wins, but we would have to be very competitive in almost every game. If it’s 2 again, it will be hard for me to publicly defend withers as I have in the past.




I honestly think a 3-win season would be a success given the roster we have, but my main point has been how long does Withers get before turning in a .500 season. At the current rate, it will probably be more than six seasons and even that is not a guarantee. Across the board, we have mostly FCS type of talent.


Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:42 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
TheRevSWT wrote:

It's painfully obvious to anyone who reads what you post that you have a hate hard on for Withers. That, and... well, you're extremely simple.





You need new lines, your baseless accusations are getting old, much like your avatar beneath your signature of Withers on a throne. :roll: :roll: :roll:


Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:43 pm
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Post Re: 4-8 vs 2-10
Bobcat.taxman wrote:
You need new lines, your baseless accusations are getting old, much like your avatar beneath your signature of Withers on a throne. :roll: :roll: :roll:


I'm so sorry you are offended by your own simpleness. Hopefully, one day you'll recognize how silly you sound and make a change.

Or, you can keep on being you, and folks will call you out for being absurd. Either way, no skin off my nose.

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Wed Jul 25, 2018 6:21 pm
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