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 Thurman Morbley off team 
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txstlinds wrote:
So the numbers whole is even bigger or were they already factored in?

depends on the last time we checked... withers has mentioned numbers a couple of times over the last few pressers, and it definitely went down this week, so he may already be accounting for them. i want to say it was 65 or 64 at the monday presser, and it was 67 the week before.

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Sun Nov 12, 2017 8:45 am
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*hole

I caught it when rereading the quote above. I'm an idiot.


Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:01 am
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I lack any knowledge about scholarship reuse.
When do these four scholarships become reusable to offer?

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Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:36 am
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scholarships are for 1 year, and once is assigned, it is done for the year (although i don't know how that works w/ jan enrollees - is that gone until next jan, or clock starts again in sept??).

for instance - withers gave one of the available scholarships to a walk-on this summer who turned around and quit the team 2 weeks later, so that one was burned for the year. he couldn't turn around and offer it to someone else.

my guess is that these would not be available for use until sept 2018, so no change to what we can/can't do in terms of numbers for the 2018 class.

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Sun Nov 12, 2017 11:16 am
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Post Re: Thurman Morbley off team
Ugh. Don't care about Tiggs as he was a senior and I pretty much gave up on his potential after the Arkansas game last year.

Morbley, Eastling, and Tutt were all guys I thought could make a huge impact for the program. Morbley was easily our best freshman WR in 2016, Eastling also had a really good freshman year at CB, and Tutt looked really good physically for his age despite his injury.

I'm sure we'll never know exactly what the violations were, but I sure am curious.


Sun Nov 12, 2017 11:50 am
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Saul, I'm curious, who was that walk-on? I don't remember hearing that.

This really highlights what a different perspective someone can have if they aren't tuned into the current situation and how the team got here.

I'm sure this happens to teams across the country in some form or fashion (kids quitting, being cut, offered schollies, etc.), and obviously not to such an extent, but I wonder if TXST has set some sort of FBS record here.

Can anybody else think of some of program cutting to the bone like this? Outside of some penalty assessed (ie - SMU's death penalty).

Let me also state that I agree with Wither's approach. We are all aware as fans and followers of TXST football the almost insurmountable amount of apathy there is with alumni/students.

To get rid of that/turn the tide takes winning. As previous coaching staff approaches went; the goal was to win quickly and maintain. With that comes possible progress (2013 and 2014 seasons) but no consistency. Mostly winning against lesser teams/programs with the occasional signature game mixed in. (UH 2012, Southern Miss 2013, Tulsa 2014). Those wins were against teams with losing seasons.

This is all to note that it is an uphill battle for a coach that wants to keep his job. Winning games keeps that job. For how long depends on the perceived progress combined with W/L.

I believe Withers knew this situation he was coming into, but not the depths into which he would need to carve. The only time a coach can blow it up/rebuild with some time to spare is in the absolute beginning. This beginning it seems has creeped into Year 1a.

Granted, each program across the country has it's share of kids that aren't focused (I'm not trying to call kids out, that's just weird to me as an adult who isn't a: the coach or b: the parent of the player). However, there is no margin of error when it comes to rebuilding with a purpose. With no base of talent to make up for a few knuckleheads, every player, EVERY player must get on board. Otherwise, with reduced numbers, the effect pervades and acts like an anchor.

Lastly, I don't know the situation for the above 4 that were let go. I don't claim to either. This is my high level perspective of turning the RMS Titanic aka TXST football. I like what I see and I'm proud of the fight these players have.


Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:26 pm
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txstlinds wrote:
Saul, I'm curious, who was that walk-on? I don't remember hearing that.

i don't know, and i don't remember hearing anything about it either (but w/ our program/reporters, that doesn't surprise me). came about while chatting up a player's parents last at the game yesterday.

txstlinds wrote:
I'm sure this happens to teams across the country in some form or fashion (kids quitting, being cut, offered schollies, etc.), and obviously not to such an extent, but I wonder if TXST has set some sort of FBS record here.

Can anybody else think of some of program cutting to the bone like this?

texas just a couple of years ago when strong took over and kicked 10 players off the team. big difference is ut didn't have a bunch of guys quit on their own.

one thing i noticed as i was researching how we got here - fran was bringing in a bunch of juco guys and withers isn't. when you don't refill your jucos at the same rate, your upperclass count drops like a rock and leaves scholarships on the table. it will come around and even up eventually, but combined w/ the dismissals and quitters, it has really compounded the numbers issue.

2018: 21 verbals - 1 juco
2017: 26 commits - 4 juco
2016: 23 commits - 4 juco
2015: 24 commits - 7 juco
2014: 28 commits - 9 juco
2013: 22 commits - 10 juco

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Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:52 pm
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Post Re: Thurman Morbley off team
Saul Goodman wrote:
txstlinds wrote:
So the numbers whole is even bigger or were they already factored in?

depends on the last time we checked... withers has mentioned numbers a couple of times over the last few pressers, and it definitely went down this week, so he may already be accounting for them. i want to say it was 65 or 64 at the monday presser, and it was 67 the week before.


The numbers I remember withers saying the last 4-5 weeks was we were at 68 and something about only getting up to 74 next season so we'd be still without 10-11 ships to get to 85. Then last week, he said 64 so there goes those 4 that were kicked off team.

After you consider some things like how Eastling was the first CB used last season to becoming the nickel back, now we know why. It likely had nothing to do with his play rather his off the field shall we say. Tiggs could be argued the same. Morbley the same with not starting the season as a 1st team player and Tutt was well... potential great but obviously other things were more important.

Can cry or move on. I prefer to move on.


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Saul Goodman wrote:

texas just a couple of years ago when strong took over and kicked 10 players off the team. big difference is ut didn't have a bunch of guys quit on their own.

one thing i noticed as i was researching how we got here - fran was bringing in a bunch of juco guys and withers isn't. when you don't refill your jucos at the same rate, your upperclass count drops like a rock and leaves scholarships on the table. it will come around and even up eventually, but combined w/ the dismissals and quitters, it has really compounded the numbers issue.

2018: 21 verbals - 1 juco
2017: 26 commits - 4 juco
2016: 23 commits - 4 juco
2015: 24 commits - 7 juco
2014: 28 commits - 9 juco
2013: 22 commits - 10 juco


This is a very notable difference between Fran & Withers, and is probably why Withers will be given time. It seems Withers has generally written off the juco transfer method, and is going for something perhaps more sustainable. I sort of get it, as I felt we were way too dependent on juco transfers under Fran.

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Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:21 am
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Post Re: Thurman Morbley off team
Saul Goodman wrote:
one thing i noticed as i was researching how we got here - fran was bringing in a bunch of juco guys and withers isn't. when you don't refill your jucos at the same rate, your upperclass count drops like a rock and leaves scholarships on the table. it will come around and even up eventually, but combined w/ the dismissals and quitters, it has really compounded the numbers issue.

2018: 21 verbals - 1 juco
2017: 26 commits - 4 juco
2016: 23 commits - 4 juco
2015: 24 commits - 7 juco
2014: 28 commits - 9 juco
2013: 22 commits - 10 juco


I remember the day that Fran got hired, an A&M fan at work came over to me and said, "You like JUCO's? You better cause Fran sure does." Every year on signing day I was reminded of that co-worker.


Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:45 am
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Post Re: Thurman Morbley off team
If I was Withers I would look for legitimate 2 sport athletes and work with other coaches on them using scholarships for these recruits then offer that recruit a walk on opportunity to football. Would this be a legal move? Get the football player a scholarship but through another TXST sport without dipping into football scholarship pool.

Just trying to think outside the box here.


Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:58 am
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Post Re: Thurman Morbley off team
It's been awhile since we've had a Colby Targun or a Jeff McVaney.


Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:07 am
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BobcatDis wrote:
If I was Withers I would look for legitimate 2 sport athletes and work with other coaches on them using scholarships for these recruits then offer that recruit a walk on opportunity to football. Would this be a legal move? Get the football player a scholarship but through another TXST sport without dipping into football scholarship pool.

that's not how it works. any dual sport athlete that plays a head count scholarship sport (fb, hoops, vb) counts towards the head count sport.

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Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:47 am
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Post Re: Thurman Morbley off team
Yeah I think I'm reading you right. that's what I'm getting at.

Example: John Smith is a track athlete at Port Arthur Memorial in 200 meter hurdles. Texas State Track offers John a track scholarship. He signs LOI, enrolls, but while here he walks onto Football as WR/DB. Football scholarship is saved and track scholarship consumed. Are we on same page?

BTW I didn't come up with this scheme on my own. I feel like I saw this in a documentary somewhere.


Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:20 pm
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we are on completely opposite pages.

john smith would be on a football scholarship and track would get the benefit of a saved scholarship.

this is done specifically so non-rev sports can't carry football and hoops.

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