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 ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)...... 
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SuperCat

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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Saul Goodman wrote:
how? with that ol, please tell me what you would do to get more out of the offense in our next game.


I agree pretty much with what you said before this. I think we've seen enough. First half look decent. Second half defense makes changes and we don't.

I'd simplify blocking schemes if they're not already simplified. No need to make them complicated for young players. Limit their need. Shorter passes, more roll outs.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:50 pm
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SuperCat

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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
LSU Bobcat wrote:
LT Spider wrote:
Teaching fundamentals is easy. Teaching fundamentals to the level that players can execute at game speed against teams with more physical talent is hard. Teaching all of that in the 2 months you have to get a bunch of freshmen up to speed (our situation) is damn near impossible.


So Williams is a freshman now?

let's go back to what my comment was, since you guys clearly seem to get off topic easily. More focus needs to be placed on fundamentals, pocket awareness, throwing, routes, ball security, catching, etc. We learn these fundamentals at an early age. These are not new to these kids. More emphasis needs to be placed on fundamentals by our assistant coaches. That includes every player, from new to vet.


I didn't know that we were only talking about the QB position. Overall, the lack of fundamentals can be attributed to youth seeing the field earlier than they would have in most programs. Those kinks get worked out in practice and limited game action over a couple of years. They then start when they are fundamentally sound, have a solid knowledge of the system, and have spent a couple of years in a D1 conditioning program. Our guys have none of that then get thrown on the field and we wonder why it looks like we arent coaching fundamentals.

As I stated earlier, coaching fundamentals is easy. Executing them against older and more talented opponents is difficult.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:33 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
lets not forget that younger, less experienced players get better faster by playing older, more experienced players, and we don't have any of those.

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Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:40 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
LT Spider wrote:
LSU Bobcat wrote:
LT Spider wrote:
Teaching fundamentals is easy. Teaching fundamentals to the level that players can execute at game speed against teams with more physical talent is hard. Teaching all of that in the 2 months you have to get a bunch of freshmen up to speed (our situation) is damn near impossible.


So Williams is a freshman now?

let's go back to what my comment was, since you guys clearly seem to get off topic easily. More focus needs to be placed on fundamentals, pocket awareness, throwing, routes, ball security, catching, etc. We learn these fundamentals at an early age. These are not new to these kids. More emphasis needs to be placed on fundamentals by our assistant coaches. That includes every player, from new to vet.


I didn't know that we were only talking about the QB position. Overall, the lack of fundamentals can be attributed to youth seeing the field earlier than they would have in most programs. Those kinks get worked out in practice and limited game action over a couple of years. They then start when they are fundamentally sound, have a solid knowledge of the system, and have spent a couple of years in a D1 conditioning program. Our guys have none of that then get thrown on the field and we wonder why it looks like we arent coaching fundamentals.

As I stated earlier, coaching fundamentals is easy. Executing them against older and more talented opponents is difficult.


I'm not trying to blame everything on Williams. He just seems to produce a lot of problems. I remember when he came in against LSU and he looked pretty decent. Did he regress? Get lucky vs LSU? We've had quite a few drops by Wr's (not just freshman). I have a huge problem with our CB's not turning and looking for the ball. Poor coaching or kids just no talented? When waddy gave up that last TD, never even tried to defend the ball. Just stayed facing the WR and stuck an arm up. It doesn't matter the age.

Since my original point is for offense. Of course you recruit kids to fit your scheme, but your scheme needs to be able to evolve. Not blocking well? Bring in a FB to help out. No pass protection? Move the pocket or bring in a mobile QB. So far our offensive coaches haven't shown us they can adjust and make anything work.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:58 pm
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SuperCat

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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Saul Goodman wrote:
lets not forget that younger, less experienced players get better faster by playing older, more experienced players, and we don't have any of those.


You can't say we don't have any, we just certainly don't have many. Younger players should be able to look up and learn from the older guys. Well the older guys are Fran's guys. That kind of screws us. That's why i don't blame withers for running off the losers that didn't want to stick it out. That doesn't mean expectations should be diminished for the younger players, though.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:02 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Honestly, I haven't been a fan of Williams. Its just been hard to judge a qb when his wrs drop so many balls and the OL doesn't provide much in the way of protection. Despite some mistakes, I thought Jones looked like he had more upside and we should go that direction.

From a former player (hs only) perspective, I know the most about OL, DL, and LB play. Secondary is a foreign world to me. I cant tell if its coaching, talent, or both.

To your last point about adjustments. I think Withers is coaching a lot of these games like he would a scrimmage. Its all about player development and getting them the experience running what they will be able to successfully run later. In general, coaches should manipulate their systems to fit their players. I don't think he is in that mode yet. He considers this season 1a of his tenure and its all about practice and experience. Will it work? I have no clue, but next year I will start to place expectations on him as far as winning some games.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:26 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
LT Spider wrote:
I think Withers is coaching a lot of these games like he would a scrimmage. Its all about player development and getting them the experience running what they will be able to successfully run later. In general, coaches should manipulate their systems to fit their players. I don't think he is in that mode yet. He considers this season 1a of his tenure and its all about practice and experience. Will it work? I have no clue, but next year I will start to place expectations on him as far as winning some games.


^This. I get the same feeling when watching this team play. It is clear they are outmatched and outmanned, and I'm sure he is trying to for the W. But at some point (around the halftime mark) I think he is thinking more about the long term goals about building the program rather than short term (winning the current game). If the game looks like it is out of hand (which most will be due to size and talent differentials) I think he moves on to program building goals. It hard because selfishly as a fan I want to see wins and I want to see them now, but I think I get what he is trying to do and I can live with that.

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Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:38 pm
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SuperCat

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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
LT Spider wrote:
Honestly, I haven't been a fan of Williams. Its just been hard to judge a qb when his wrs drop so many balls and the OL doesn't provide much in the way of protection. Despite some mistakes, I thought Jones looked like he had more upside and we should go that direction.

From a former player (hs only) perspective, I know the most about OL, DL, and LB play. Secondary is a foreign world to me. I cant tell if its coaching, talent, or both.

To your last point about adjustments. I think Withers is coaching a lot of these games like he would a scrimmage. Its all about player development and getting them the experience running what they will be able to successfully run later. In general, coaches should manipulate their systems to fit their players. I don't think he is in that mode yet. He considers this season 1a of his tenure and its all about practice and experience. Will it work? I have no clue, but next year I will start to place expectations on him as far as winning some games.


Nice points and your perspective is far better than mine! I like Jones too. Not just because he'll mature more and get better, I just like his style of play. Williams is more of a pocket passer and we just don't have the personnel for that up-front, yet the kept with it for 5 games. Made no sense. But he got no help from his WRs. I can't remember if they did it or not, but we're going for it on 4th and short just bring in a FB. Don't recall us using a FB much. Maybe we're using one and i'm just blind as hell.

Like someone said a game or two ago after a TO. It's the same crap game after game and year after year. Some preventable mistake that turns the game into the other team's favor. These mistakes and be decreased but they sure as hell seem to happen to us a lot!

And if that's Wither's goal that's fine. Most of us didn't have much expectations for the team this year anyways. Except Phrat who prob wanted at least a new years bowl. Next year will definitely be a decent litmus test for wither's tenure.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:45 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Well...

Same story. Miscues, turnovers, lack of execution for a young team. Keep in mind we have lost key players for season in Hays (becoming our top WR), Davis (starting DE that was reliable to do his job), and Anyama who is back now (our best pass rushing threat).

A grad senior that fumbled the ball in last 3-4 games is no Bueno and by now, this is the best he's going to be. He lost 3 weeks of fall camp and well... that was HIS fault not TXST or coaches. With all that said, I still think I'm not ready to give up on chances to win games with an experienced QB but if we did go with Jones... I'm not going to argue it.

That is just QB. Young WR crew means needs experience, miscues on catching passes or running routes; OL changes does change chemistry but they did better than I expected; defense also is having chemistry changes on DL weekly due to losing Davis and injuries to backups. Secondary young and it shows.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:05 pm
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SuperCat

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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
At this point next year, we will probably know how Withers is going to turn out for us.

09/01 - at Rutgers
09/08 - Texas Southern
09/22 - at UTSA

We will probably be 1-2 after this stretch but its reasonable to expect 0 blow outs and measurable progress in how the team looks. If we have beat downs against rutgers and utsa I will have my doubts about it getting fixed.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:13 pm
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SuperCat

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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
LT Spider wrote:
At this point next year, we will probably know how Withers is going to turn out for us.

09/01 - at Rutgers
09/08 - Texas Southern
09/22 - at UTSA

We will probably be 1-2 after this stretch but its reasonable to expect 0 blow outs and measurable progress in how the team looks. If we have beat downs against rutgers and utsa I will have my doubts about it getting fixed.


Hopefully Wilson amd crew have been hired away from utsa before next year.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:29 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Bobkat34 wrote:


A grad senior that fumbled the ball in last 3-4 games is no Bueno and by now, this is the best he's going to be. He lost 3 weeks of fall camp and well... that was HIS fault not TXST or coaches.



Devils Advocate: you could say that's the coaches fault to put a player that missed that much Fall camp in a position to fail when, by all accounts, WJIII looked the part of a starter from day one.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:10 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Bobcat.taxman wrote:
Bobkat34 wrote:


A grad senior that fumbled the ball in last 3-4 games is no Bueno and by now, this is the best he's going to be. He lost 3 weeks of fall camp and well... that was HIS fault not TXST or coaches.



Devils Advocate: you could say that's the coaches fault to put a player that missed that much Fall camp in a position to fail when, by all accounts, WJIII looked the part of a starter from day one.

Did he though? I'll admit, I wasn't at practice before the season like you, but the few times Jones has come in prior to the ULL game, he didn't look comfortable or effective. I think the extra time as back up has given him the opportunity to get better and grow. Which is why he looked good against ULL.

I'm still hopeful for the future under Withers, only because I know how bad of a position we are in, but if he isn't winning 4-6 games next year and being competitive in most if not all of our games, I won't be as open minded.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:04 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Jones played well last night but dont act like he looked like a starter at the beginning of the year. I seem to remember that he fumbled the ball 2 out of the first 3 times he touched it...correct me if I'm wrong.


Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:07 pm
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Post Re: ULL Game Thread (in case El Gato is MIA)......
Saul Goodman wrote:
LSU Bobcat wrote:
Do you think a mike leach coached offense could score more points than 14 per game?

first year in pullman the cougs were 108 out of 124 in offense. scored 7 or fewer pts in 4 games. how does a genius like leach get shut out for 59:59 against a team giving up 25ppg? or for 59:03 against a team giving up 24ppg?

a mike leach coached offense scored 3 points vs cal's defense (#64, 26ppg) in his 6th year leading the cougars.

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Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:06 am
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